Tanking and the Draft

[Deleted]

Ben - the auto point solution makes a TON of sense to me.

In the extreme case that a team actively tried not to tank, but got blanked every week, their probability of receiving a top pick is directly proportional to how early they are eliminated - which is likely early, if they're truly struggling that badly.

This also provides some cushion for GMs that take over struggling teams mid-year (the accumulation of points despite having a rough go), yet provides an incentive to not tank (because those points alone do not secure a top pick).

[Ben (Rays GM)]

Dec 27, 2015 15:26:04 GMT -5 @mmotta said:

Ben - the auto point solution makes a TON of sense to me.

In the extreme case that a team actively tried not to tank, but got blanked every week, their probability of receiving a top pick is directly proportional to how early they are eliminated - which is likely early, if they're truly struggling that badly.

This also provides some cushion for GMs that take over struggling teams mid-year (the accumulation of points despite having a rough go), yet provides an incentive to not tank (because those points alone do not secure a top pick).

Thanks Matt, I thought it was a pretty elegant solution as well

[Jon (Astros GM)]

I think I like that way better guys. But that team should only get that point if they do not have any available players stashed in their bench. If they do then they should not get the point.

[Billy (Cardinals GM)]

I like that system as well. My main concern was that teams eliminated early could be at a disadvantage but giving points based on when they were eliminated helps that. I'd be fine with something like that.

I do agree with Jon though. The points shouldn't be given if there are empty spots and/or players are stashed on the bench.

[Ben (Rays GM)]

I mean, no doubt about it this is a major change, and will take some getting used to. It would be pretty unique to our league, and a significant difference from MLB. But I think it's worth it. Ultimately it's gonna have to go to a vote. Does anyone not like the idea of giving one automatic point per week eliminated? Should I put both options on the poll or just that one?

[Jon (Astros GM)]

I think one overall rule will suffice. Let's not make it too complicated. The Gold system seems solid with the point per week for each team that gets eliminated. I also would say that if the team eliminated does not field a lineup with active players on the bench the should not get a point for that week.

[Deleted]

Dec 27, 2015 10:45:55 GMT -5 Jon (Astros GM) said:

If the gold plan fixes the issue of teams not signing guys to fill out a roster then I'm all for it. But we also need to find a way to ensure that guys can't just trade away players and still not be able to field a lineup. One or even two spots is acceptable but my worry is teams that do that will effect a playoff race even though they are being penalized with a worse draft position.

Some thoughts here

- Might be good to have a clear and stated league definition of what is a "legal lineup" or not. I've seen this in fantasy football leagues, where a team cannot start a BYE week player or defense, nor leaving any starting scoring position empty . Then I suppose define what are exceptions to the legal lineup situation i.e. protect teams who are trying but don't have a next man up in depth versus a team just not trying and wanting to game the system.

- To prevent free agency churning i.e. going after free agents and signing them, with or without a discount, for the purpose of trading them during the season and at the deadline to amass assets and further the tanking, something the real NFL does it accelerating a prorated cap hit upon a players release or trade. For example, if I try to trade a player less than one calendar year after signing him, and he's on the Cant Cut List, I get a "tax" of Z percent that operates as dead money on my next years cap. That tax then works as an overall tax on every FA signed the next season by said team. I.E. if a team keeps signing just to trade, every free agent they sign the next year costs 10-15-20 percent more than their winning bid. The dead money hit would decrease the longer you hold said player before you trade him.

- Using the Yahoo Can't Cut List as a demarcation point. I think there's a big difference between taking a chance on a vet in free agency that didn't have high expectations, isn't super desirable, giving him a chance, watching him break out a little or have a career year and then try to get some value by trading him to a contender versus just intentionally signing big ticket guys to trade them. For example, if a guy is on the Can't Cut List, he can't be traded unless there is a practical replacement on the sending team's roster, or the receiving team must send at least a minimum grade replacement going back the other way. This won't protect all free agents, but I think it would restrict the very cream of the crop, the ones more desirable to churn.

- Using a "slot drop" as a penalty. I.E. instead of creating a cap punishment, make it so if a team games the system to a draft advantage and he violate X or Y stated rules on the defined "legal lineup" standard, he doesn't lose his pick or picks, but he takes a 3-5-7 slot drop from where he would have normally selected. I.E. if Team X gets the first overall pick in the current system because he left four positions empty all year, then he is penalized by taking a 7 slot drop. He actually picks 8th. The incremental reward goes to the teams he tried to game the most. This slot drop would be effective in every round of said draft. If the same team gets penalized over and over the slot drop becomes progressive. i.e. on the 2nd violation, now it's 9 slots for every pick he has.

In summary, if you want to game the system you can, but you'll be taxed for it. If you want to sign free agents just to trade them and churn them, then go ahead, except now every free agent you sign will be more expensive and dead money will choke out your cap flexibility to do it. If you want to non organically tank, then eat a draft slot drop.

Again, some random thoughts on the matter, thanks.